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  • NautiqueJeff
    replied
    robertsmcfarland I may have one that will work for you. Does yours look like this? If so, and you're interested, shoot me an offer!


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  • scottb7
    replied
    These boats are - at least in my opinion - VERY expensive toys and while it is great to be able fix them cheaply, it is not always possible. Hopefully skidave or bturner or someone else will get a hold of a few of these someday and learn to fix them.

    What always gives me pause is when i go to buy a part or something expensive to fix something and they are like "ok, you get 90 day or even one year warranty." I am sure it gonna happen to me, but scary when you pop for $4,000 and they only give you a year warranty. But the vast majority of the 2013 linc are still working so knock wood any new one people get will work for a good long while.

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  • ScooterMcgavin
    replied
    Originally posted by robertsmcfarland View Post



    i don't think any body is is faulting the look and information the linc screen gives its what happens when it breaks down, it makes the boat useless, it should be a quick fix or replacement not a 4 thousand dollar solution .
    I agree with this statement

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  • bturner
    replied
    Agreed. Also one feature about this flat screen implementation not mentioned is that it's a huge single point of failure that would never be allowed in a commercial vessel. Of course modern commercial vessels have computer based technologies and flat screen displays as central feature in their deployment but they are also built with redundancies and back up systems. If one breaker fails or the screen goes out on you're Linc system you lose all those features mentioned and are unable to monitor the simplest and most critical systems of the boat, that is if it'll even start.

    As to if it's a necessity..... brother please. Linc is a nice toy to have but please don't tell me it's a necessity. It may be a necessity for the "family truckster" you've created to turn on the lumbar massage system in drive's seat, the disco ball and the Christmas tree like light show with 200 strobing colors but there are far more people getting by with a set of gauges and set of switches. Of the items listed there is nothing that couldn't be controlled manually with a basic understanding of their operation and a few hours learning the operation of the boat from a YouTube video or heavens forbid reading the manual. But that would take a desire to learn and develop skill in operation of the boat and you know a lot of this market segment is well, really busy. As to navigation, I already own and carry a GPS system in in my pocket called a smart phone. I've also taken the time to develop a skill called navigation and also learned what the navigational aids on the lake mean so I know where I can and can't safely go with my boat without a system telling me where to drive.

    While Charles certainly makes many great points on system integration and advancements in technology within the boating industry I believe more importantly that there have been outstanding advances in hull, engine and other more critical systems. With this however comes the near ridiculous features that load these boats up options that owners will never use or will set once and never touch again. That, along with the initial cost of these features that have pushed the price of a new boat into the stratosphere, the other down side which started this thread is the inability to provide reasonably priced service parts or tools to troubleshoot these systems when (and yes I said when, not if) these system fail. $4K for a display in a boat that will all too soon be worth $25K is ridiculous. If the industry stays on this course there is a very good chance they could kill off the food chain that feeds them as without a healthy used boat market to keep the new boat market alive they'll knock the bottom out of the market when people are no longer willing to risk buying a boat loaded with items that will cost $4K to repair and are more likely to fail as they get older.

    Lastly, what a system like Linc does is dumb it down for the masses which is perfectly OK. It masks the complexity of having to actually operate the boat or understand things like the effects of ballast, trim and control of vessel and thus yes it is a skill thing. But I get it. This is how you broaden your base and make your product more appealing to the masses and I certainly would not fault any company for wanting to achieve this.
    Last edited by bturner; 4 weeks ago.

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  • robertsmcfarland
    replied




    i don't think any body is is faulting the look and information the linc screen gives its what happens when it breaks down, it makes the boat useless, it should be a quick fix or replacement not a 4 thousand dollar solution .

    Leave a comment:


  • charlesml3
    replied
    The days of analog gauges are over. They're gone. You can call it "razzle dazzle" all you want, but it's still very functional. With these displays we can now manage all of this from a single screen:

    - Engine vitals (oil pressure, temp, fuel, volts, speed, rpm, diagnostics, water depth, air and water temps)

    - Speed control settings

    - Ballast controls and displays

    - Surf system controls and displays

    - Stereo input selection, zone, tone, volume, etc

    - Lighting controls

    - GPS Mapping

    - Other stuff I'm forgetting.

    Doesn't matter. This simply cannot be done with analog gauges anymore on a boat this size. GPS mapping couldn't be done on anything but a digital display anyway. Towards the end of the analog gauge era, we were already seeing "gauge sprawl" with some of them being moved down near your right leg. There just wasn't anywhere else to put them. These multi-function displays allow the manufacturers to condense a lot of information into a smaller and more usable space. The displays can be context sensitive and shift according to what you're doing. It's not about lack of skills. It's about the presentation of information and the ability to easily manage the various systems we have now.

    -Charles

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  • bturner
    replied
    Originally posted by Nautiquehunter View Post
    My biggest fear is the high tech electronics and non redundant systems will cause these boats to be worthless especially after the manufactures no longer supplies parts for them. Go by any German auto repair shop you will see a ton of high end cars that will cost more to repair than there are worth. I think all the brands have beer pushed by the demand for useless razzle dazzle that not only drives the sales price up but will in time make them unrepairable . The way they are going they are truly a hole in the water you throw money in.
    What's driving the move to automation and electronics is a desire for manufactures to expand the market so that any moron can operate a surf boat. A quick look at added features or features in development tells the story......
    • Don't know or are are not willing to learn how to drive your new boat..... that's OK we'll throw on a set of $10K thrusters and a $10K steering system to compensate for your lack of skills.
    • Don't understand how or are unwilling to learn how to set up your boat to surf.... that's OK we'll develop a $10K system to put on every boat to cover your lack of skills to do so.
    • Don't understand how or are unwilling to learn how to lower your tower.... that's OK we'll develop a $15K power tower to cover you inability to learn how to do so.
    It used to be that you had to have an understanding of boating to be on the water and to operate a boat properly. If you wanted to do any water sports past tubing there were things you needed to learn how to do to extract the best experience. What all these screens and electronics do is allow someone with virtually no skill or understanding of boating to get in and drive. Now moms or dads that have no interest in driving boats or boating can jump in their 25' $150K surf boat and pull the kids around the lake with the boat doing the thinking and work for them. True boating idiots looking like pro's through the wonder of electronics. First owners of these boats really don't care about maintenance or repair as 3 - 5 year bow to stern warranties have been built into the initial cost of the boat which probably adds about $10K - $15K to the initial cost and will cover everything a low skill boater will break during that period. When the warranty runs out they'll just trade the boat in or get out of boating altogether. While this is a high cost solution for the average boater, take a look at income demographic of who's buying these boats. This target group doesn't mind the added cost as long as it makes the experience easy and all worries about maintenance and repair are covered, the easy button so to speak.

    As to repair-ability..... I do believe with any broken system there is an opportunity. In this case I can see where a specialty market or service sector business opportunity exists. Just as with the retro fit gauge packages from those early 2000s Nautiques were developed I believe you'll see similar solutions develop for these as well. As I posted above if I'm capable of repairing computers I'm certain of doing the same with these systems as well. The key and challenge will be to find the suppliers that are making the components and establishing channel for those repair parts.

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  • shag
    replied
    I feel it should be an option, not a standard equip.

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  • Nautiquehunter
    replied
    My biggest fear is the high tech electronics and non redundant systems will cause these boats to be worthless especially after the manufactures no longer supplies parts for them. Go by any German auto repair shop you will see a ton of high end cars that will cost more to repair than there are worth. I think all the brands have beer pushed by the demand for useless razzle dazzle that not only drives the sales price up but will in time make them unrepairable . The way they are going they are truly a hole in the water you throw money in.

    Leave a comment:


  • robertsmcfarland
    replied
    thanks!! start calling tomorrow ...see if I can up with some directions ,I can not be the only nautique owner with a broken linc screen out of warranty ..

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  • scottb7
    replied
    I am pretty sure all the nautique stuff is made by https://www.enovationcontrols.com/brands

    https://www.enovationcontrols.com/ne...-correct-craft

    They somehow own zero off and make the pdm's in our boats and the displays.

    https://www.enovationcontrols.com/products/displays

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ65...ature=emb_logo

    https://www.enovationcontrols.com/pr...an-i-o-modules

    https://www.enovationcontrols.com/di...tactile-button

    https://www.enovationcontrols.com/displays/glass-front
    Last edited by scottb7; 4 weeks ago.

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  • Skidave
    replied
    I used to work for a major medical equipment manufacturer. I could see all the pricing for our parts. Here is a real example: A $7K customer part would cost the manufacturer $850. The customer paid the full price unless they had a service contract. Once a CT scanner cracked a tube. Not covered under warranty and not part of the service contract (due to the way it was damaged). The bill was $250K. That's nothing in the medical field. Go quench a MRI magnet..and pay, pay, pay.

    I repair electronics. Some vendor makes the display and some other vendor engineered the electronics. Then a third vendor puts it all together. It's a matter of finding who makes the display. It is very possible there is no part # on the display and it is custom made for this application and no other. OR, it will be an off the shelf display used by many in various applications.

    Sent from my SM-J337V using Tapatalk

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  • bturner
    replied
    Well if we get a broke on that someone wants to send me I'd be willing to pull it apart and see if I can't run something down.

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  • robertsmcfarland
    replied
    all understood..thats why I started this thread hoping someone by now would have found the needle in the hay stack...

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  • bturner
    replied
    Anything man makes can and will break eventually. As far as repair goes.......

    If they're sending them somewhere to be repaired that means someone is repairing them, which in terns means there's repair components available for them, right? Unless they've discovered some way of creating components through mind control they have to be buying said components from someone. Now how difficult it is to repair or expensive the parts are well, that's another question but any "closed loop" repair service is just a license to print money for someone.

    Take cell phone screen replacement for example. For years you couldn't get a screen replaced if you wanted to. If you broke your screen you bought a new phone. Then magically they were able to send them away and for 3/4 the price of a new phone you could get them repaired. Now you can go to the mall and get one replaced for about $100. I believe this is the same scenario that you're seeing being played out here. It's $4K to replace because they can charge whatever they want for one.

    Another example would be the laptop I replace the panel on. HP wanted about ~$500 to fix it. I bought the panel on line for $75 and replaced it myself. Add the "marine" value add tax multiplier that is added to anything that says marine on it and you have a panel that costs maybe $200 going out the door for a grand and the repaired item being sold for $2K. New is twice the cost of repaired for $4K. I know this is a somewhat jaded view but this is what happens with a closed market. Don't believe me? Every get an estimate for fixing an Apple computer versus an Intel based system. The cost difference is amazing. But then again the guys fixing the Intel based machines don't have the title Genius attached them them.....

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